Self-Love: Release Self-Doubt & Build Self-Compassion

Apple PodcastsGoogle PodcastsSpotifySoundCloudStitcherPocketCastsYouTubeOvercastAmazon MusiciHeartRadioPandora

November 4, 2021

Mom &… Podcast


Show Summary

Megan Logan is a licensed therapist and author of the SELF-LOVE WORKBOOK FOR WOMEN.

In this episode we talk about Megan’s experience writing the workbook, and veer off into some writer-specific territory for a few minutes. Then we get back on track, and talk about what self love means, how to be intentional about it, and why it’s much deeper than taking a bubble bath.

This episode also covers the pitfalls of social media, particularly how it can damage the way you see yourself. The V-word comes up this week, too. Not that v-word… we’re talking about values, silly. Megan – and her book – have some great exercises for diving into values determination, setting boundaries, and knowing when to let things go.

Megan is a native of Annapolis, Maryland. She graduated Summa Cum Laude from James Madison University in Virginia with a Bachelor’s Degree in Social Work and a Minor in Family Issues. And then a  Master’s Degree in Clinical Social Work from Florida State University. For the last 22 years, Megan has provided mental health therapy in a variety of settings including domestic violence and sexual assault centers, foster care agencies, community-based mental health programs, hospice, and currently private practice. 

Helping others heal through challenges and adversities has given her wisdom and insight on how to become unstuck and move forward in life. When not providing therapy, Megan enjoys spending time outdoors with family, hunting for shark’s teeth, and reading. 

Topics From This Episode (Complete transcript is available below… scroll to the bottom!)

  • Self-Love
  • Self-Care
  • Values
  • Boundaries
  • Inner critic
  • Mental health

Resources and Links From This Episode 

Look, Listen, Learn



  • Singing Bowls


Connect With the Mom &… Podcast

  • Please subscribe to the show wherever you get your podcasts! If you’re so inclined to give us a 5-star rating, we’ll love you forever. Who couldn’t use a little extra love?
  • Leave us a message – via voicemail or use our form – with your questions for experts, or suggestions for future episodes.
  • Check out our website, where you can find links to all the things!
  • Follow our Facebook Page
  • Join our private Facebook Group (All you have to do is ask to join, and then be nice once you’re in. So easy!)
  • Follow us on Instagram
  • Become a patron – check us out on Patreon!

Musical Notes

Our delightfully happy intro and outro theme music, “We Will Get Through This” is performed by Young Presidents, and used under license from Shutterstock.

Megan Logan Self Love Workbook

Transcript* From This Episode

*Please note that this transcript is automatically generated through our editing software. Expect odd errors and misunderstood words. In fact, if you find a really funny one, send it to us, and we may feature it – and you – on our socials!

Missy: [00:00:00] Welcome to the mom and podcast. I’m Missy Stevens, a mom and writer. Foster care advocate. And this week I am not a squirrel or deer advocate and nobody come for me. They’re pulling up all my new plants, like pulling them up, deciding, oh, we don’t eat these and throwing them in the garden,

Susanne: my

Missy: like, or not like in my yard and my front yard.

I planted a

Susanne: They’re not replanting them for you.

Missy: Yeah. So are there not my friends this week.

Susanne: Oh, I feel for you. Yeah, we got one of those. I’ve got some rocks for you. Let’s talk. Um, not to throw it there’s squirrels or anything that it’s for.

Missy: I was like, my aim is bad. I don’t know that I was.

Susanne: And I am Susanne Kerns. I’m a mom and writer, LGBTQ advocate, and this week and NaNoWriMo prepper. And if you don’t know what NaNoWriMo is, it’s probably, it’s probably best for you. It’s National novel or in my case, nonfiction writing month is November. So yeah, don’t expect to see your favorite bloggers online for the month of November.[00:01:00] 

But today, we are so excited to be welcoming. Megan Logan to the show. Megan is a native of Annapolis, Maryland, and graduated Summa cum laude from James Madison University in Virginia with a bachelor’s degree in social work and minor in family issues. And then a master’s degree in clinical social work from Florida State University.

I mean, that’s a lot of degrees. Bravo. That’s good. If that is not enough for the last 22 years, Megan has provided mental health therapy in a variety of settings, including domestic violence and sexual assault centers, foster care agencies, community-based mental health programs, hospice, and currently in private practice, helping others heal through challenges and adversities has given her wisdom and insight on how to become unstuck and move forward in life. And when not providing therapy. Megan enjoys spending time outdoors with family hunting for sharks teeth. I want to hear about that more and reading, and one of the things we’re reading and we’re going to be talking about [00:02:00] today is your amazing self-love workbook for women.

So we’re going to be jumping into that shortly, but first welcome. Thank you so much

Missy: Welcome.

Susanne: here.

Megan: Thank you for inviting me. I’m super excited to talk to both of you and I’m sure we’ll have a wonderful conversation.

Susanne: yes.

Missy: really excited. So we want to start just major huge congratulations on the workbook. It’s number 85 across all of Amazon, not number 85 in self-help workbooks for women, but it is number 85.

Susanne: it’s number one in all of those, but

Missy: It’s number one and so, or workbooks kind of thing. So, um, but anyway, amazing. And so that tells us there’s a huge, huge need for that, but what drove you really to write that book?

Megan: You know, it’s really interesting. I wish I could say that , it’s been on my mind and my heart for many years. , um, I got an email maybe two years ago from a publishing company about writing the self-love workbook for women. So it wasn’t something that I came up with. The [00:03:00] title already had been, I guess, developed already.

And, um, I said, you know, this is right up my alley. I’d never written a book before. It’s definitely something that I do in my clinical practice. I have my own personal experience with self love as a mom and a woman. And, I decided that it would be the perfect thing for me to do. And it was a very structured approach.

I had to turn into chapters every week. And so within 

Missy: wow, 

Megan: it was written, which is not apparently how most books are conceived.

Missy: but this is the second time this week that someone has told us they wrote a book in a month,

Susanne: Okay. 

Megan: full time during it. I just sit it on the weekends or I wake up in the middle of the night, like three between three and 5:00 AM and be like, oh, this will be a good 

Susanne: Oh 

Missy: Susanne, you and I got to get off our butts.

Susanne: Okay. Well, you know what, that’s good inspiration for NaNoWriMo, cause it is it’s a month. That’s the whole theory behind NaNoWriMo is that, you know, you don’t necessarily have a final, like turn into the editor draft, but you’ve got a rough draft by the end of the month of a book. If you chip away at it on a day by day basis.

So [00:04:00] good for

Missy: I ought to do this with you, Suzanne.

Susanne: You’re doing.

Missy: Okay. 

Megan: There’s another opportunity that I have now after writing this book and it’s been probably six months and I’ve maybe written a chapter,

Susanne: Thank you. Thank you for the reality check. Yeah.

Oh, wow. Well, 

Megan: We got that way. 

Susanne: And 

Megan: Thanks. 

Susanne: obviously well received my goodness. I mean like, like we said, number one across pretty much all the self-help categories, the workbook categories, um, of what, 

Megan: Yeah, 

Susanne: like?

How exciting. 

Megan: well, I wrote it when I first said I was like, I’ve always wanted to write a book and then I was like, I can just keep a stack of my office and give it to clients when they come in.

Susanne: Yeah.


Megan: I didn’t think anybody would buy it. so it’s done really well and it’s, I think they’re selling it.

I can only access the U S the amount that it has been sold, but I think it’s all over the world in different countries. I’ve gotten people that have reached out. And so [00:05:00] that’s kind of 

Missy: Amazing. 

Susanne: And now are people reaching out to you directly? Like what kind of feedback are you hearing from women? Because just looking through the Amazon reviews, I mean, it seems like it’s seriously changing some lives 

Megan: Yeah. It’s. 

Susanne: in such an amazing way. Like, are you, are you feeling that, are you giving yourself a chance to soak that in,

Megan: Yeah. You know, I, um, I never had an Instagram account prior to this and, uh, so I started one and then I got rid of it for awhile. And then last January, I started it again and I’ve gotten rid of it since then. I, I just, um, but through there,

Missy: it was gone. Yeah.

Susanne: um,

Megan: put it back up at some point, I, I don’t know why I’m not super big on social media.


Missy: It’s rough. 

Megan: have reached out is by messaging me. I get people call, I’ve had a couple people call me, um, a couple people,

Susanne: on the phone.

Megan: emailed them a couple of times because I got the wrong version of the book and I’m like, oh, sorry, I don’t own rights to the book. Like, if the publisher’s book, I just wrote it.

But, um, yeah, I guess he can find anything on the internet on how to get in touch [00:06:00] with

Susanne: Oh my goodness. Well, 

Megan: um, 

Susanne: creepy now. I’m just so curious because we hear a lot about this, where women who thinks that they are practicing quote, unquote self care. It’s like I showered today. , I ate a meal, , and they’re like, Ooh, I saw I was practicing self-care and same thing with self-love.

I think that people are probably, , if their inner critic is not just totally berating them that day, they’re probably like, Ooh, I really, even myself loving myself. , so I think that people probably have a weird definition of what self-love is, , improbably don’t hold themselves to a high enough standard for what they deserve, from self-love.

So can you tell us a little bit about , what self-love is and what that really looks like when it manifests in your life?

Megan: That’s a, that’s a great example. I think self care gets interchanged with self-love. It’s a part of it. A part of self love is, is practicing self care and really nurturing yourself. Um, so than just doing your basic routine hygiene and [00:07:00] eating.

Susanne: Yes.

Megan: now a bath can become an experience where you do some meditation in the shower or you practice mindfulness.

And so those things that are common in our daily lives, I think can be opportunities for us to set an intention and be very mindful of what we’re doing so that it can be a part of a self-love practice, not just for the sake of taking it. , and then the other thing that kills me with self love is a lot of people will think if they post a picture and they get a certain amount of likes or people are like, oh, you’re beautiful.

 Or I love myself check out my new hair, um, that that’s, uh, a version of self love. I just really think it goes so much deeper than that. It’s more about learning to embrace your special gifts and qualities and talking lovingly and kindly to yourself and encouraging yourself so that you can then share it in the world so.

It’s not necessarily meant to be all about yourself. It’s not selfish in that sense, but we can change the world that we live in. If you start with loving [00:08:00] yourself first.

Missy: I love that point about it, not being about the likes. And we’ve already talked a little bit about that. You don’t care for social media that much. And I think that’s so healthy because that stuff is going to disappear. It might come back in another iteration, but that’s not reality. And it just because people like my picture of my new shoes or whatever, that’s not, that’s not validation that has to come from somewhere deeper.

Megan: Yeah, I think that’s very true when it comes to comparing ourselves to others. There’s just a lot of it’s like, it can be used in a very positive way, so I would follow inspirational things or podcasts, or just different things that would really speak to me. But then I would find myself getting back into this trap of I’m going to post a picture of my kids.

So people will think I’m awesome as a mom or just some different things that I would catch myself doing. So I go through spurts, um, where I’m on social media and then I get off of it and take like a, kind of a detox 

Susanne: Yeah, I feel like we could have, I mean, it could be probably a week long seminar, but we could [00:09:00] have a whole just podcast episode about that as social media and what that does as far as being detrimental to your self care and our I’m sorry. to your love and cm. I’m guilty of it already.

Interesting interchanging self-care and

Missy: um, I like how you said confusing. I think that’s a great word, because you might be getting yourself all squared away doing the work, and then you hop on Instagram and it might be a really innocent or really helpful post, but it gets in your head in the wrong way. Like, well, they’re doing this, I’m not doing that.

Like maybe I should add that to my routine or why can’t I fit that in my routine. It just confuses what you’re doing sometimes. So you do have to be in a healthy place to make social media work for you.

Susanne: Instagram just, released whether they wanted it to, or not. Um, the negative impact that Instagram and social media have on teenagers. , and I mean, that impacts their [00:10:00] self-love. , so I’m curious, do you see this with your clients or the feedback that you’ve gotten from the book that this, that social media does play a big impact on that?

Megan: Yeah. I think the comparison trap is where I see that a lot, especially for teenagers where they’re know even something is as simple as maybe their friends all got together and they, they weren’t invited. And then they think, well, nobody likes me. I mean, I can’t imagine having social media when I was that age, uh, just , how much damage I would do to myself.

Um, and all the meaning that I would put on things. So I do see that and I also work with eating disorders. And so that is a huge thing that we talk about cleaning up your social media and making sure that you’re not exposing yourself to things that are promoting even indirectly, , things about your body and what it should look like.

And you know, whether you’re good enough.

Susanne: And like you said, or indirectly, I mean, I feel like there’s so many things that are on the periphery of that, that look so innocent, but they, they dig in [00:11:00] there, they get into 

Megan: Yeah, it’s the ducted. It’s very, it’s very subtle. Sometimes some of those things, it’s not something that is always blatantly obvious. So even, even if you’re looking at a magazine and it’s been airbrushed and the person has no pores, you’re not saying, oh, this person has no pores, but you notice that somewhere subconsciously that their face is perfectly smooth.

So I look at myself in the mirror. My face is not smooth.

Missy: right, right. It’s really dangerous when you’re young, but it’s not that much easier as a much older lady that I am now. Like I still find that I, I love that you called it insidious because it, that doubt creeps in. And so as we were going through the workbook, , I feel like the lessons in there could be really powerful in helping that self-doubt part, like when the doubt starts to creep in to give you tools.

But can you talk about that a little bit? Like how does developing your knowledge and self-love help. [00:12:00] Not care about the pores or not care about that other person’s career that you’re comparing yourself to or whatever it may be.

Megan: So this is another little story I always like to tell is that I think it was last January. A woman contacted me from Virginia and said that she was doing a self-love book club using the book and wanted me to kind of guest speak at it. And I was like, sure. So. Loving the women so much, I joined it and I became a participant.

And so every week I would do the activities and then I’ve done that a couple of rounds, and that’s a huge piece that comes up is not caring, what people think, learning to be able to let go of other people’s opinions and placing value in that. And so there’s a whole chapter on releasing self-doubt and challenging those automatic, negative, critical beliefs that we get from society.

We get from our childhoods, we get from different traumas and things we’ve been through. And those, those messages get internalized become kind of our narrative for how we talk to [00:13:00] ourselves. And that’s one of the first places to start. I think when you’re talking about self-love outside of the self care, but being able to say, you know, this is not helpful.

These thoughts are not helping me feel better and do better.

Susanne: Yeah. And we talk about that a lot, especially around career tracks where, I did not have a parent that was, you know, driving me saying, oh, you need to be the doctor. You need to be the lawyer. But I think there are so many people out there who are making decisions based on other people’s desires for how their life plays out. And that does put doubt.

And I’m, I’m really curious, like how, how do you. Clients. I mean, I’m sure it takes months and months of work and not

Missy: Can you fix us

Susanne: yeah,

Megan: I may give you the formula in five minutes.

Susanne: I’m sure that’s a common thing where people are, you know, you got these women entering menopause and they’re still trying to figure out what their college major should have been. Um, because you know, sometimes you don’t [00:14:00] take the time to think about, or you don’t have the, the confidence in yourself to believe that what your gut is telling you is right.

And you, instead you want to test to answer it, you know, you want to know, oh, I’m an ISF J so that means I got to do this, , so, and just really, how do you then use that? The tools of self-love to build that trust with yourself and to shut up that self doubt, , to be able to help make decisions in your life.

Megan: That’s a great question. There’s a couple of exercises in the book where I don’t necessarily phrase it that way. , but I like that because self-love is a lifelong journey. So whether you’re in your teens or whether you’re in your fifties, it evolves. And then at the same time, it’s always the same.

So where we are in life depends on, I guess, that goes along with our values. So our values can change and evolve. And if I’m making decisions based on what my values are, because I truly know myself and I’ve done the work to be able to love and embrace myself, I’m much more likely to end up having things in alignment in my life [00:15:00] and feeling fully satisfied, maybe not always happy or joyful, but just being able to know that I’m congruent with my values and it shifts in my twenties, what I might have valued, might’ve been security.

And now that I’m approaching 50 and my kids are getting ready to leave the home, I’m valuing and just what really matters. And so it just shifts over the years. I think that’s all kind of, part of self-love is knowing your, knowing your worth, but then knowing what your values are.

Susanne: going to jump on that one in a heartbeat. That’s one of our

Missy: made my stomach flip. I always have the blip because yes. We’ve been talking about that since the beginning.

Megan: , Yeah. 

Susanne: a lot of the coaches we talked to, I mean, that’s just one of the core things that you have to do before you can do anything else, but , I’m sure that 80% of what you would say, like is like, here’s how you should go about figuring out your values.

It’s probably pretty similar to what other coaches would say, but has their own special approach to it or their way of thinking of it. [00:16:00] That may be the finally the thing that helps it go ding, ding, ding, and someone’s heads. I’m just really curious. How do you approach when someone comes into your, like, I really need to know.

Rock solid on what my values are. Like how, how do you have them approach that?

Megan: So one of my things that I do is ask a question and depending on what’s going on in their lives, I phrase the question differently, but I think the most powerful one is, and , I just asked a teenager , yesterday in a session was like, If you were to die tomorrow and they were to give a eulogy.

And then I had to explain what a eulogy was and they were going to, they were going to get up and talk to you about, you know, talk about you. What would you, would you want them to say she got straight A’s or she was 112 pounds or, you know, she, she did everything perfectly or would you want them, what would, what would you want them to say about you that those are really gonna pull out your values?

I would like somebody to say that I made a difference in their life or that I’m kind, or that I was always to expand my knowledge and learn things like then that, that resonates with [00:17:00] what my values are. So it can be, if you were to die, what’s important to you. And what would you want people to say, or if they were to have a celebration in your honor for your 90th birthday?

If death is, you know, a little bit too morbid.

Susanne: I love that. I just saw your stomach flip messy.

Missy: Did, did you see me like lean in?

Susanne: I did.

Missy: back cause I was like, oh my gosh,

Susanne: Yeah, no, I love that. And I’ve heard again, I think there’s just a different way to approach it and we’ve talked about values with a lot of different coaches, , but that’s never come up and I have heard, you know, that idea of you want people to say about you or , what do you want to feel at the end of your life, but I’ve never heard it tied together with values.

So that is a nice, like, that just connected some signups as in my brain, I think as far as, yeah,

Megan: It’s really ultimately what your whole life is about. So , if you make that about living your life in that way and figuring what that is, then that’s going to change the direction of wherever you end up. Um, [00:18:00] and, and the thing with the values that I think that I didn’t ever really understand, and this isn’t in a book, but they, they evolve, they change.

They’re not static. So it’s an ever changing process to check in with yourself and figure out, do that work.

Susanne: And how often do you recommend that people? Is that just an ongoing, know, thing that you’re just thinking in the back of your head? Or do you encourage people to sit down? Hey, new year’s is coming. It’s a good time to like reevaluate, or is it more of a seasons of life type of thing where people should check in.

Megan: I noticed that me personally, this isn’t what I necessarily always tell other people is when there’s like a growing discontent 

Missy: Mm. 

Megan: not right in my life. I can feel it. I’m trying to find it and other things or outside of me. Um, and that’s when I can tell, okay, you’ve got to do some evaluations or some figuring things out.

Susanne: oh, 

Megan: and then. In the book, it talks a little bit there’s I think it’s later in the book of the, there’s a whole section on setting boundaries and being 

Susanne: [00:19:00] yes, 

Megan: and needs, and that fundamentally can change some of the relationships that you’re in. So 

Missy: Yeah. 

Megan: you, when you start practicing self-love and doing the values work, sometimes it radically changes things and some people are not a hundred percent ready for that, that change and what it can do.

So it’s very hard work. ,

Susanne: it is. It is. And I’m really CA I was going to ask you and Missy kind of alluded to this, like, I feel like the workbook is just. It’s kind of take little savory bites of it. I mean, it’s not something like I’m going to sit down this week and didn’t do the workbook, so, and and it really is something that, yeah, I mean, that section, you know, might be a couple of pages in the workbook, but it could take you weeks.

It could take you months to really work into it. Um, so do you have recommendations? Is it something that has to be done in chronic logical order? Is it something that, a certain amount of time should be spent on each step? Like how, how, I mean, I know you can’t tell readers how to read it and some probably do do it in a weekend, but in your perfect [00:20:00] vision for how people would use the work, like, what does that look like?

Megan: I think it’s going to look like, however, somebody individually wants to do the workbook. It’s 

Susanne: Yeah. 

Megan: in a way that you have to do it front to back cover. there is an introduction part that’s a little bit, probably the only narrative in the book, really, because it’s all about doing the exercises that I do think is important because it, defines what self-love is and 

Susanne: Yeah. 

Megan: not, and why it’s important.

And then, you know, the structure of the book is releasing self-doubt and then building your self-worth and then having healthy relationships so that you can kind of. Model that in your whole life, but it doesn’t have to be done that way. And the exercises can be done and whatever, whatever appeals to you, I would pay attention to the exercises you’re flipping over that you’re choosing not to do because sometimes I think that can be something sometimes it’s just cause it’s extra is it’s kind of stupid.

And then other times it might be because it’s, you’re avoiding something.

Susanne: That is such a good point. And I, [00:21:00] even though there is a simplicity to them, I don’t think they are easy. I mean, it really, I, I mean, I don’t want to infringe any copyright things, but I mean, each page is like, I mean, it’s got

Missy: Yeah, there’s work to be

Susanne: you know? Yeah. 

It’s an easy, but not simple or simple, but not easy. Like, you’ve really got to dive. You got to do the work. I mean, , it might just be filling in five lines or 10 lines or whatever’s on the page. But the work that you have to put into thinking about goes on those 10 lines.

 I, I think it warrants some special time and actually, you know, doing the self-love of knowing that you deserve to put the real time and effort behind it and not feeling like you should just go and fill in the blanks.

Megan: Yeah, the exercises are simple language and simple looking and it’s pretty. So, you know, it looks like you’re going to sit down and have this lovely, enjoyable time with this book. But if it’s got some zingers in there, it’s got some really deep [00:22:00] things that can kind of trigger stuff from, you know, the past or memories or things that you haven’t thought about that can really make you feel uncomfortable.

That’s been some of the feedback that I’ve gotten in doing the book clubs is that some of these questions are kind of uncomfortable, um, which is. Part of the whole point is to get 

Missy: Right. Okay. 

Megan: that self love is so much deeper than just the surface. figuring out who you are.

Missy: Do you have advice for people who may be asking for myself, but you get to that point, you get to that point and it does require a little deeper. And there’s a level of fear there because, you know, in my case, I know I might blow up some things. , whether it’s just internal, the way I look at things, it’s just as hard as possibly having to set boundaries in a relationship to me.

If I have to undo the way I’ve thought about something for all of these years, that’s scary. So if someone says, I’m just afraid and I can’t do this. Like how do you help [00:23:00] encourage them to get past that?

Megan: So I am doing it in a group is really kind of a neat concept because it is supportive and yet you’re kind of accountable. 

Missy: Um, 

Megan: there’s been plenty of groups I’ve showed up and I haven’t done any of the exercises, but I still get a lot out of it by talking and listening and thinking about it. So I would say maybe to start with it, just, just reading the question and not actually doing the work, but just reading it and marinating in it and kind of putting in the back of your mind, thinking about it is a start to that.

It’s confronting it by looking at it and seeing it without necessarily having to be super vulnerable. You can do the work with a therapist. A lot of therapists that I know that are I’m friends with them. Like, oh, somebody came in with your book the other day.

Susanne: Oh, my

Megan: So you can use it as an accompaniment to that, or any coaching that you might be doing.

And I think sharing it with other people is kind of a way to get support. So you’re not doing it alone and trying to tackle all of that heavy, heavy stuff. So [00:24:00] ended up, I think to the way it’s laid out in terms of there’s like a, uh, power to playlist for women. Like you make it like a playlist of songs, which is fun.

That’s not really necessarily going to trigger a whole lot. It

Susanne: I love the one that’s in there too. Yes.

Megan: Um, and then there might be one about what’s your most vulnerable childhood memory you’ve ever had. So, so they’re, they’re kind of like if you do a hard one, spend some time doing some fun, easy ones or do some self-care afterwards.

so you don’t have to do all of it at once.

Missy: I love the idea of marinading. I’m a big marinade.

Susanne: Well, I know, and I think that’s a really great idea for people who are just kind of easing into it. , just ask the question, like literally just reading it and asking, you know, don’t say it out loud or whatever, and then just go on with your day and , see what connects and what happens in there.

Cause yeah, it can be, it can be a little hard, , for people who haven’t done it before. And I just love the idea of a workbook. Um, because I think sometimes we do just, we read stuff or we listen to stuff [00:25:00] and we’re like, oh, what a great idea. Yeah. I should do that someday or whatever. And so this is very much it, yeah.

That day is today. Even though like fill it in.

I know. And I, I think it would also be, uh, Missy and I were talking about this. It’s so pretty. I almost didn’t even want to write in it. I’m like, it’s so pretty. but I do think it can just even be something that you use as a prompt for a journal too. Even if, if you can’t, if you can’t get over the pretty book syndrome, I do this with journals too.

I’ve got a beautiful, beautiful, beautiful leather-bound whatever journals that I just can’t I’ll instead I’ll write in like the 99 cent spiral notebook because I’m like, they’re too big. They’re too pretty. 

Megan: To get a big feather pen and

Susanne: Yes. I know. I should just be like, no, the talk about self love

Megan: that’s your self care? That’s your self love

Susanne: I am worth the book to

Missy: You are worth the pretty book.

Megan: You can, there it’s cheap enough on Amazon. You could buy a book right in it and then have another copy that

Susanne: that’s true. I know it is [00:26:00] actually is a really good deal. And I was saying, I was like, my mom needs one and my daughter needs one. And you were saying you were talking to a teenager the other day. So I’ve got a 16 year old daughter. And I just feel like you cannot start this soon enough. , so is there something , it sounds like you do work with teenage clients.

Is this something that you’ve seen working for them out? I mean, obviously self-love, again, you can’t start that

Missy: start early 

Megan: Yeah, I w you can tell, I work with teenagers, I think just by some of the exercises, um, this that’s probably how I communicate my Lang, although I have a 16 year old daughter too, and now that I’m older, like I connect with the kids, moms or the parents, when they’re talking about their parents and I’m like, well, have you ever thought about this? Um, 

Missy: From her perspective, I’m guessing.

Megan: yeah. So, um, but it is, it is written for , different ages, but I think if you don’t read the exercises and do them, if you’re older, you might be turned off by it thinking, oh, this is kind of just, you know, a little [00:27:00] simple workbook for younger people and it’s not.

And because the, you know, the questions are so much deeper than that, but it definitely can be used for probably 13 and up.

Susanne: Yeah. Okay, good. I don’t know, I would love to kind of do it in collaboration with her, but I also think maybe it’s something that, , I should just let her kind of ease into it on her own

Megan: Oh, that’d be 

Missy: of it’s kind of private. 

Megan: book club doing a teen book 

Susanne: Yes.

Missy: It’s a great idea. 

Megan: yeah. I saw my daughter it with her colored pencils one day and I was like, oh, 

Susanne: Oh, 

Megan: a room doing some of the activities. So

Susanne: oh, Zoe’s would probably be all drawn with pictures, but I do think that that would be a fun thing for them to do. I think they would be open to that as a book club and it might, you know, have, it’s obviously very light and silly moments and I’m sure that there is, but.

Megan: Yeah, 

Susanne: that that would be worth a

Missy: Yeah, that’d be awesome.

Megan: yeah. 

Susanne: Hm. I might just throw that idea out there, but it’s talking about all the different life stages now that we are no longer teenagers. A lot of our listeners are at various [00:28:00] stages of a career break. Um, that is our point and trying to make sure that whether it’s first taking care of kids, or if it’s for taking care of elderly parents or whatever your situation may be, that women are having this self-love and using this time to reflect, um, the time that we have not our, I hate to say our spare time is you’re taking care of kids.

That’s a, there’s not

Missy: There’s really not.

Susanne: Um, but the, the little confetti time that we do have, you know, maybe throwing in one of these exercises here and there, wherever we can, but there’s so many questions. What’s next, what’s next in our life. What’s next in our career. Who am I, you know, like we were talking to empty nest isn’t too far 

Megan: Um, 

Susanne: , so what are some of your favorite exercises in the workbook for helping women with this whole, who am I, what should I be doing next? Um, obviously the values exercise is part of that, but you know, where do you kind of steer people when [00:29:00] they’re struggling with those questions?

Megan: I think the values is probably the first place. So starting of what’s important to you and then really trying to like, figure out what are your gifts? Like, what are your, not so much talents, but what are the qualities that make you, because so much we identify as I’m a mom or I’m a therapist or our roles that we’re in.

Susanne: Yeah. 

Megan: And so whenever somebody says, well, you know, tell me about yourself. Well, I’m a mom and I’m like, well, what does that mean? So what makes you a good mom? Like, what is it? Well, you know, I. touch with being able to support and nurture my kids. Okay. So you’re nurturing. So like, just to try to find that you have in those roles, I think worth exploring.

then again, the last one of the later chapters in there, which is all about, , speaking your truth, , and setting boundaries and asking for what you need or want. an exercise that talks about your body language paying attention to what your body language is like when you’re sitting in a waiting room or when you’re walking down the sidewalk with [00:30:00] somebody, do you, do you look down, do you look away?

Do you make yourself smaller? Do you sit know upfront and be 

Susanne: Um, 

Megan: So just how do you show up in the world? 

Susanne: I love that. And as we’re encouraging women to okay. Form those boundaries and stand up for those what happens. We’re very fortunate that we have spouses and families that are very supportive of Um, but I, I can’t imagine that all women have that privilege. And so what does that look like then for, for women who maybe their spouse is like, no, I really like you in this role.

I really like you being defined by this and that works for me. And is making me uncomfortable that you’re exploring these other things. So how can they either get, buy in or recognize that maybe the buy-in is not going to happen and they have to make some decisions.

Megan: Yeah. I mean, that’s really sometimes what happens is things start shifting and you start realizing, wait, I’m not really able to be who I really am. And I need to [00:31:00] reevaluate kind of where I show up. And maybe it’s not so much that you don’t need to be in that relationship, but maybe you show up in another way by you love gardening and you get to like allow yourself to do something that you really enjoy, that makes you happy to grow things.

It doesn’t have to be huge life changes. It can be you take time to maybe spend more time in nature because that’s something that you all have always enjoyed. So it can be small little ways that you celebrate and the things that you’re interested in and maybe incorporate into your life,

Susanne: I like that.

Missy: I do too. I just read something the other day and I cannot remember where I read it. I’ll try to remember and put it in show notes, but it was saying that like not every relationship needs to be blown up. Re- looking at yourself doesn’t mean you’re headed for a divorce, but sometimes that does need to happen.

Oh, I think it might’ve been Ann Imig talking to us about that. Or maybe it was in her newsletter. Maybe it wasn’t as she told, but I’m just [00:32:00] saying that doing this work doesn’t mean everything will be on done. Although sometimes you do discover. You have within you to make a really big change that’s really needed.

So it’s, it is scary to do it, but there’s not a reason to not do it. It doesn’t mean you’re 

Megan: yeah. 

Missy: court.

Megan: And when I wrote the book, I was one month after having been divorced. So I had gone through some of, you know, re-evaluating things in my relationships and things that, and I’m actually very good friends with my ex-husband and he’s here right now, putting in a fire pit in my backyard,

Susanne: That’s nice.

Megan: but still, you know, it doesn’t always have to blow up in a negative way. It,

Missy: That’s true.

Megan: the best healthiest thing that ever happened in your life. And even though it’s scary and it’s change and it’s really hard to do that. So, it all starts with just figuring out who you are and what is important to you and finding ways to, to incorporate that into your life and in your world.

Susanne: And although the, you know, the cover says self-love [00:33:00] workbook for women. I mean, some men could use this as well, obviously. And

Megan: I wish I’d just said humans. Cause I think, I think the whole, like there’s, again, I didn’t come up with the title. 

Susanne: yes,

Missy: Yeah. 

Megan: I’m sure it has something to do with sales, but, um, you know, I think that everybody, 

Missy: Yeah. 

Megan: self-love how you feel about yourself is at the root of everything you do in this world.

Susanne: yes. 

Um, and, and even, I mean, something that probably couples could do together, I think that would open up a lot of understanding. Um, we’ve talked about, , Steph Baron hall was one of our first guests who came on into the Enneagram in love. , and that’s one of the things I keep threatening my husband with.

And like, I can make you read this book, then you’ll understand what number you are. Cause I think I know what number you are. Um, But I do think that anything that helps us have a better understanding either with our spouse or any family member, it could be with a parent or with the teenage daughter or whoever.

Um, I think that could be a fun exercise to do together, but [00:34:00] some of it, I, I think the self in the name means it’s self reflection and something that you really need to just take time for yourself to think about.

Missy: And I feel like knowing all of those things about yourself, also very beneficial in your relationship, because then you understand why you’re reacting a certain way or why something pushes your buttons or why something causes you so much more concerned with one person than it does with another. 

Megan: Yeah. And it’s not indulgent. A lot of people will think a lot of the women that I’ve talked to that have started on the using the book will think, well, it’s kind of, you know, selfish and indulgent for me to be spending all this time on myself. I should be taking care of other people or making sure everyone else’s.

Okay. And so I don’t think self-love is selfish. I think it’s actually the opposite. I think if you take the time for yourself, then you can give and share your light in the world. And, I don’t think that the work is indulgent at all.

Susanne: Now, I mean, you, if you bring yourself but more wholly to the world, I mean, [00:35:00] holy H O L Y I mean whole like your whole self fully. Thank you. I know. I, yeah, I’m probably the last person. You need to be bringing anything holy, but I will bring my whole self to the world or at least work towards it. Um, yeah, I mean, that just helps everybody and modeling that for your kids.

I mean, I can’t imagine anything better. So yes, we encourage all the ladies out there. I mean, if we can’t convince you seriously, just go read some of these Amazon reviews. Holy cow.

Missy: Yeah,

Megan: Yeah. Some of them are, it’s really neat to, I’ve always worked. One-on-one my whole career direct service. One-on-one with somebody, maybe some groups here and there along the way. so it’s really neat to write a book and have a large group of people be doing the work and be impacted by it because I don’t, you know, in therapy sessions, you don’t normally get feedback like, oh, this has changed my life.

I mean, you’re just doing the work along with the person. So it’s kind of [00:36:00] neat to see people doing the work and how much it means to them.

It’s a really cool feeling.

Susanne: and I’m very, very hopeful that you are doing some special events or like in-person seminars or anything. Please tell us that that is part of your plan. Cause I really feel like you need to do that.

Megan: I just got branding photos done. So those were like my newest, um, I’ll have to put my, oh yeah. I mean, that was my, I don’t know. It’s just not, my I’ve always just been behind the scenes and then maybe this is how I’m showing up in the world differently is, you know, I’ve always been in my office doing therapy and I’m have a very, very successful practice and I’m busy.

And so, 

Susanne: Yeah. 

Megan: uh, I think the book club that I’m doing with one of the women now that we do weekly, we have another one starting in January. So that’s opened it’s virtual. So it’s open to anybody to do the workbook along with us. Um, and me and her both kind of facilitate that.

Missy: How do people find

Susanne: Yeah. How do we find that right now?

Missy: Yeah, kind of people. 

Megan: Instagram [00:37:00] after today, I’ll put my Instagram back up.

Susanne: Just the one picture on there.

Megan: I don’t know, I I’m, I I’m working on another book, but that’s not going to happen probably till next fall where that gets done. Um, and that’s all on nurturing. then, um, I don’t really have any seminars or trainings or anything like that. I, I should, I do podcast interviews and that’s, but

Susanne: my gosh. No,

I’m seriously. I’m seriously. Like you need a Ted talk.

Missy: we’re just encouraging you to go do said something like 

Susanne: Yeah. Can we book you? We’re booking you at the mom 2 conference. We got you for the Texas conference for women. And what else can we do? We’re going to get you lined up. 

Megan: It’s just hard for me to envision doing all of that, just because it’s change. And it’s just not what . I’ve been doing. So I’ve gotten very comfortable with seeing eight clients a day and doing therapy 30 people a week. And I’m good at it. No one 

Missy: that is busy 

Megan: It

Susanne: Yes. 

Megan: love it and I’m good at it.

And, , it [00:38:00] keeps me busy. So it’s hard for me to, I did start taking Wednesdays off. but I do a lot of more like administrative stuff. So I do have time to, to come up with something new and 

Susanne: Yeah. 

Megan: a training together or

Susanne: Well, if you’re feeling 

Megan: that. 

Susanne: doubt about it, we’ve got a really great workbook.

Missy: Although, I think I’m listening to you say how much you love. Like

You’re not in a season of discontent. You don’t like, you are happy with where you are. So I think that’s important to listen to as well,


Megan: I, I loved writing the book because it was a totally different experience. And I love doing podcast interviews and meeting people and getting to talk about all this kind of stuff. Um, so it’s a different level of intensity 

Missy: yeah, 

Megan: therapy every day for eight hours. So I definitely get energized by doing these kinds of things and talking about self-love and so I’m sure I would love that too.


Susanne: Well, and it could be a little blend of both, but no, I just,

Missy: And maybe it’s on the horizon.

Susanne: [00:39:00] yeah, just in meeting you and seeing the value that people are getting out of it. And I, I know that there’s such a intense value of doing it one-on-one and the people who are lucky enough to have you in their lives, in that capacity. I mean, that’s just really exciting, but any way to help, you know, get this message out on a wider scale.

I just think the whole world would benefit from. So in case you ever need to cheerleaders to tell you that yes, we will support you any way we can, uh,

in doing that. 

Megan: to you guys about self-love honestly, that’s what happened with the book club. The woman that I met that did it she’s a photographer. And she was like, I mean, literally the only photo it’s on the back of the book that existed on me 

Susanne: Yeah. 

Megan: JC penny headshot from

Susanne: Oh, there it is.

Megan: that’s like the only photo I’ve ever taken. That’s like a professional photo. So she has inspired. And then she inspired me to do this whole photo shoot was 

Missy: Yeah. 

Megan: of what I normally do. So it’s kinda neat how, like I get back [00:40:00] and still evolving and doing the work, 

Susanne: Yes. 

Megan: that we all have that work to do.

Susanne: Oh, that’s so

Missy: the idea of evolution is so powerful. Like we aren’t stuck when, who we are today and we are mom and dot, dot, dots. Were so much more and it’s exciting. , it used to overwhelm me. And now it’s just exciting, like who knows what’s next?

Susanne: making progress. Missy. Look at us.

Megan: Yeah. That is super exciting.

Susanne: Oh, well, oh, we’re getting to the time for the look listen learns. Yes. I have one that’s actually related. I’m very excited about this, but, um, so yeah, the look, listen, learn is a segment where we talk about some stuff of our professional lives to enhance dots after the mom. And, and so they can be silly, useful, useless.

I need to stop saying that or, 

Missy: They’re all somehow useful,

Susanne: all useful in some way by now. Missy. You kick it off. You’re a 

Missy: Absolutely. Sometimes you can have [00:41:00] one thing or three actually have three short things today, the first one is yesterday. We were talking about our calendars. I have, I don’t know if you can see it back here. Oh, wall calendar that was miraculously on the correct


Susanne: so proud of you.

Missy: Yeah, Susanne said, is that right?

I can’t see it. And I was like, oh, it’s probably August back there, but it really is October back there. , but I was telling her that my favorite calendar that is often on the wrong months is Ling Chang’s Ling’s calendars, and I’ve been getting them for a years. And Ling Chang is an artist.

She does botanicals. And I clipped mine up on this little board every month. And sometimes I forget to change them. And then I’m sad because I missed a whole month of beautiful pictures. so I’ll link to Ling. That’s hard to say link to Ling in the show notes. Although I looked this morning and there’s nothing about 2022 calendars.

So hopefully I’m not doing a look, listen, learn that you can’t get your hands on.

Susanne: Ling may 

Missy: be doing, 

Susanne: doing some self-care this year and taking a year [00:42:00] off and the calendar. We’ll

Missy: I mean, selfishly I’ll be so sad, I can’t remember when I started doing these, but I mean, it’s going before my child was born and he’s 15 and I’m probably going on 20 years of Ling’s little calendars.

Susanne: Ling deserves year off.

Missy: no,

Susanne: Give

Missy: so I highly recommend them and hopefully they will be for sale, but it’s just beautiful botanical prints every month. And then, um, this book, Self-Compassion: The Proven Power of Being Kind to Yourself by Kristin Neff was recommended by a guest a couple of weeks ago. Imig I’m pretty sure is who recommended it.

So I just got it. I can’t too much about it because I just started getting into it, but, and she actually has a new version out radical self-compassion I think it’s what

Megan: Yeah. And then, um, it’s all about the fierceness it’s fierce self-compassion 

Missy: Fierce, That’s 

Megan: Yeah. So it’s kind of the concept. , I have referenced her in the book a lot because [00:43:00] self-compassion is different than self-esteem. Our self-esteem goes up and down and self-compassion is just constant.

It’s this being kind to yourself, no matter what. And then fear self-compassion is setting those boundaries and communicating your needs. So 

Missy: yeah, I’ve heard, it’s amazing. And I thought I’d start with the OG one, and then move on to the fierceness. Um, but I highly recommend just on the little bit I’ve gotten to get into that one. I recommended. And then my last thing that I have today is, um, also pretty fluffy. It’s this coffee, uh,

Susanne: You’re doing a commercial.

Missy: I know. My nails. Aren’t done though, but, um, this is delicious. I say it’s a rare treat, but mark has started buying me like two every week. So he does the grocery shopping here. And, , so there’s always one in the fridge at least. And it’s La Colombe, La Colombe. I don’t know how you say it. Um, draft latte with oat milk.

And um, it’s like, uh, it’s [00:44:00] pressurized

Susanne: Is it a can like, 

Missy: and it’s yeah, it’s a can,

Susanne: oh, okay. I thought it was like, I get these teabags for

Missy: oh yes, it does look like the Harney and sons or whatever. Yeah. It’s actual can, um, and they are amazing. It’s like a cup and a half of coffee. Is that what it says? Yeah. One and a half cups of coffee is what it’s about the equivalent to, but this one happens to be vegan and delicious. 

Megan: Yeah, 

Missy: a black coffee straight up plain coffee girl, but every once in a while, this is a good treat.

So if you’re looking for something. It’s just delicious. I highly recommend it.

Megan: very cool.

Susanne: I’m 

Missy: mine for this week.

Megan: So I only have two, um, and, and I’m one of them is upstairs, so I didn’t,

Susanne: Send us a picture of it later and 

Megan: okay. 

Susanne: on a video.

Megan: It is a, um, singing bowls. Have you ever seen the crystal singing bowl? 


Susanne: that do the, 

Megan: I went to a sound bath, um, at [00:45:00] the beach because I’m here in Florida and basically, you know, I’ve done them before, like in yoga where they, they play the bowls that it was just laying there.

And it was, it was like, whoa, it’s like very meditative. And so I got, I bought my own collection of them and I’m going to take a class and become a certified sound bath therapist.

Susanne: That’s amazing.

Megan: yeah. Where you do like meditation and they align with your chakras and they, they, they 

Missy: Yes. 

Megan: so you can play them in like harmony and, um, that that’s, that’s my newest thing.

And you could feel the vibration, like you can feel it down in the core of your soul. Like as you hear the music

and then the 

Susanne: a bowl?


Megan: Amazon.

Susanne: oh, oh my goodness. Okay.

Megan: were pretty expensive, but I was like, I’m going to start doing this, hopefully going to yoga studios. And like, actually, like, I don’t think you have to have a whole lot of talent to play the bowls, but,

Susanne: You’ll find out. [00:46:00] I love

Missy: that’s so cool.

Megan: and then the other thing is a book that so Instagram is not all bad. I met this, um, she’s an artist, uh, Stephanie Chinn, C H I N N. 

Missy: Okay. 

Megan: uh, has tons of stuff that are all about, like about diversity and women and loving your body. And her artwork is beautiful. And I just got her a book and I gave it to my daughter this morning.

So I’m going to, I don’t know if I can show it 

Missy: Yeah. 

Susanne: oh, yes, 

Megan: the light that I 

Missy: Yeah.

Megan: here’s sister, let me help you. 

Missy: Oh, 

Megan: got all these different things inside about self care and body love and body positivity, and, they’re just beautiful illustrations and drawings and they’re very diverse and I just, I love her stuff.

Susanne: oh, love that. 

Missy: going to have to look her up and follow her.

Susanne: Oh, my stuff is not nearly that high end. Okay. Well, one of them I wanted to bring up because it’s my learn okay. So [00:47:00] for some people it can be pretty vulnerable to write your stuff in the workbook. worried about like, what if my kids come in and, you know, read it or what if whatever 

I do 

Megan: ink. 

Susanne: Oh,

Megan: that honestly, that’s what I do in therapy sessions with kids that don’t want to have their parents read stuff as I buy these invisible ink pens. And then when they come back in, I shine the light on it and can read 

Susanne: oh, 

Missy: That is, I mean, you look at my

face, look this genius.

and then you could fill all your beautiful books and it would

look still look fairly clean.

Susanne: I could.

Megan: long invisible ink works for you. You can make juice. Remember when we were 

Susanne: Oh my gosh.

Oh my God. Oh no. I love that interruption


Susanne: that is such a great idea. Okay. Well, mine is a little bulkier than that is this lockable bag, but I got this because I realized I was doing the morning pages, Julia. Cameron’s like the artist way, morning [00:48:00] pages. And I caught myself kind of like almost censoring myself.

And it wasn’t even, it wasn’t my husband. Cause I even like I bought this and I just told him, I was like, here’s where the key is. Like, if you feel like I’m writing about all my affairs or something, you’re welcome to come in here. There’s not that. But I was like, but I don’t really want the kids, you know, to be popping in or like.

Pet sitter or who knows what? I don’t know. I’m just paranoid. Um, but anyway, it’s just like, I guess accountants or something use them. It’s like rip proof stuff and it has a little lock on it. so people can’t zip it. And so any kind of personal stuff. So you could get

Missy: Where’d you buy it?

Susanne: on him on Amazon.

Missy: Yeah. Okay.

Megan: we should be getting some sort of money for this.

Missy: We shouldn’t be doing what affiliate links we need. Affiliate links

Susanne: kind of matches the book. Like you can just put it right in there. They have been various sizes, but it’s also kind of handy. Like I got it for, um, cause I bring my journal when I’m traveling and like, not that I travel [00:49:00] anymore, but if I’m taking it to a conference or whatever, and you’re like, I just don’t want to leave this in the hotel room or whatever.

So it’s kind of a nice little safety theme there. And I think it was like 15 bucks. It’s not like a big investment. So if, if that is one of your holdups from doing the self-love workbook from women, that you 

Megan: Hm, 

Susanne: like a little vulnerable actually, writing. Down these thoughts and stuff. Put it in a little lock bag.

Like me, it 

Megan: I like that. 

Susanne: Okay. Fully. This is my full promotion 

Megan: you go.

Missy: Well, in your planner, is that color too? I think you

have a, 

Susanne: is, oh, you know what I’ve had to. I outgrew my planner. So now

Missy: Oh no.

Susanne: planner. So I need to do that. let’s see. So what am I watching? I’m watching only murders in the building. Has anybody heard of this?

Missy: I want to watch it so badly. So tell me what

Susanne: It, okay.

So Steve Martin short and Selena Gomez, which I was like,

what, how were they together? Um, but they all live in the same apartment building and they. They’ve kind [00:50:00] of, you know, see each other in the elevator and they’re not very friendly to each other. They’re just being like really stereotypical, like New York, uh, to each other.

And , they end up at a restaurant or a bar across the street because there was a murder in their building. And while they are waiting out this crime scene or whatever in their building, they discover that they are all obsessed with the same true crime podcast. And so that brings them together and then they start their own true crime podcast about the murder in their building.

And so, um, I’m only on episode one, but I’m like, I’m sold true crime podcasts with the load, these hilarious people 

Missy: that’s right in my sweet spot. I love it.

Susanne: Yeah. And just fun New York stuff too.

So is it is a comedy so far, so far comedy. Yes. Um, but yeah, and Selena Gomez really holds her own.

Missy: That’s what I’ve heard.

Susanne: Yeah, 

she actually, I keep on seeing all these promos where they’re [00:51:00] like Steve Martin and Martin short.

I’m like, forget that Selena is like, that’s, what’s probably bringing in half the audience. They want to see the young one and you’re the old people. But, um, but yeah, so that was good. And then I am listening to again, um, pivot this, a podcast with Jenny Blake, um, who I love she, one of my, do I ever. If I do, I’ll probably knock down my whole case when I bring down here, but pivot, um, she was one of the original podcast and books that ever got me started in thinking about these ideas of these small changes that you can make in your life that have these big impacts.

Um, and just like not having to make a huge change in your life, but just being able to try something else out a little bit, kind of like playing the bowls, you’re not like totally becoming a full-time bowl player, but pivoting and giving it a little try and seeing what, seeing what that feels like. , and she had an episode with Cal Newport, who I’ve heard him on tons of stuff, but I just happened to cover .

His session for the Texas conference for women , and he has [00:52:00] really good tips about his thing is about getting offline without email is the new book. And so. He’s one of those every time I’m like, yeah, yeah, yeah. I know I should be doing all these things. Like it’s he has really, really amazing tips.

My one thing that always gives me a little, ah, is that his tips are really good for like men who have wives taking care of everything else. And I don’t want to be too like gender stereotypy here, but it’s, it’s got a little bro vibe there in the sense that like, these are really great tips, but I can tell that you did not have to like pick up anybody for drum practice today.

So, um,

Missy: things like you could totally get offline if you had a personal assistant who was doing everything for you, that kind of stuff.

Susanne: it’s got a little bit, so yeah, go into it. Knowing that you might get a little. Smash the patriarchy, like flare up every once in a while when you’re reading it, but stills don’t really good stuff. And I just love, I, Blake is [00:53:00] just one of those. I don’t know. I, I like to think that I would like her in person.

Um, but she just has such a nice energy and we do a lot of yard work together. She’s not aware of it, but we do.

Missy: I wonder if she knows that. Yeah,

Susanne: She does. She’s not aware. She, she’s not my walking partner. No, that’s, that’s, brene brown Brene Brown my walking partner and Jenny Blake is my yard work partner. Um, but, but yeah, so that was a good episode that I have.

It’s been a while since I’ve listened to it. and so it was a nice one to jump back in with

so highly recommend. So yes, gosh, that’s a lot of good stuff. Okay. I need to,


Megan: I like that.

Missy: And we do keep our lists semi updated on the website. So if you’re listening for the first time, Like we have a long running list of every look, listen, learn. I bet we’re probably five to 10 episodes behind. So I’ll get in there and look up our look lists and learns and edit it. I can’t remember the last time I 

updated the 

Susanne: don’t know. You know what? We’re busy ladies. We’re setting our boundaries, our 

[00:54:00] boundary. 

Missy: of making the list, but I don’t, I think it could be more than 10 episodes

ago. Maybe. I 

Megan: That’s a good time to practice. Self-compassion


Susanne: that is our self-care compassion

and boundaries all coming together in one place. 

Missy: right. Got to sleep sometime.

Susanne: Oh, well, this has been so much fun and I really feel like we are just going to become your business managers and be able to be like, okay, you need a podcast, you need a desk, you needed this. Like, forget it. We’ll get, we’ll just give you our podcasts. You can take it over and just teach the world all this.

Missy: I mean a self-love podcast.

Susanne: Oh

Megan: Yeah. Why don’t you guys do it?

Susanne: We like to tell other people what to do.

Missy: Yeah,

Susanne: That’s our PMO. But no, this is, I feel like I’ve learned a lot. I’m so excited about getting my invisible ink and actually filling this out. Now. I truly am. I’m going to get a backup.[00:55:00] cause I feel like I want it like hand it to people all the time. Be like, oh, you need to see this.

And I don’t want my stuff in there when I’m like 

Megan: Yeah. 

Susanne: through it. But I really want to have one that I can just like, I’m at a conference or if I’m able to whatever, be like, you need to see this. Um, without

Megan: I did that. I actually had mine that I was using for the book club and I have a stack of them on my desk and was giving one to a client and I gave her and she texted me the next day. And she was like, I have your book.

Missy: Oh. 

Megan: in there that

Susanne: Oh 

my God. You just made my little lock bag clench up for my little cough.

Megan: that’s a good investment.

Susanne: Oh 

Missy: Yeah, I feel so encouraged to make my way through the book, but I also feel like I have gotten some very good tips. I’m going to lock it up. I’m going to write it and invisible ink. I could go back to journaling if I had invisible ink,

because even if 

Megan: game changer.

Missy: it really is, I’ve [00:56:00] never thought about it. We were just talking about before we even hopped on, that I often don’t write in my journals because I can’t be fully honest. And then I go back and I read it and I can tell I wasn’t being honest. I’m like, I don’t feel it was that I don’t like her. And, um,

Susanne: Self-compassion is he

Missy: Self-compassion yes. So I will quit journaling for long periods of time. And then I try to pick it up again.

I fall back into my own habits, but really the value in it to me when I am being truthful with it is just the physical act of writing it out. Helps 

Megan: Yeah. 

Missy: things. I don’t necessarily need to go back and read it later. Like 

Megan: Yeah, there’s a difference when you’re, when you’re writing or even when you’re using like your non-dominant hand to draw like that, that can be really powerful 

because you’re tapping into a different part of your brain where emotions and memories and feelings are stored. So writing has a huge, powerful effect.

It’s different thinking, speaking and writing all three have value [00:57:00] in different ways. So I think that the, the journaling, the drawing, any creativity, I think is I’ll, you know, Brene brown talks a lot about creativity and vulnerability like that. That’s when you get to the deeper level of stuff.

Susanne: Yeah. You know what, Missy, the last time I wrote in my journal was the day that I wrote about, Hey, I think I should start a podcast. And I literally put down the journal texted you. So, oh gosh, my journaling’s dangerous. Okay. Now I can’t do that. Or who knows? I 

Missy: Who knows what? You’ll start next.

Susanne: my journal is too powerful. I don’t know. I don’t. That’s why, that’s why it has to stay in a lockable bag as

Missy: yeah. Can you write down, like, Missy’s gonna finish her book, just start it in your journal

Susanne: Yeah. Maybe 

I write. I am going to finish my fourth year of my book proposal, but

Missy: Yeah.

Megan: Well book proposals. That’s another thing I just learned about from, from different publishers. Um, and again, like, because I’ve already written a book now I have some that have contacted me, which [00:58:00] is like

Susanne: well, well, yeah, when you’re number one on every category, they

might be coming to you. 

Megan: know anything about the publishing. And I’m like, who wants to write a book proposal and do all this research? And I’m like, that’s worse 

Missy: It’s hard.

Susanne: Yes. 

Megan: going to write the book and hope somebody wants to, once it, I’m not 

Missy: Okay. 

Susanne: Good for.

Megan: decided 

Susanne: I love that. I’m S I feel like my time I get done with this proposal, I, the book will be written basically. And,

Missy: Which is kind of the point in some non-fiction right. They want to see that you have the chops 


Megan: Oh 

Susanne: Yeah. 

Missy: finish the actual book.

Susanne: Well, that’s actually part of what started the podcast, because I had to do all these comps and figure out what other books are out there that are similar or whatever. And then I got really interested in the books and I was like, I want to learn more about the author who wrote the book. And so I was like, let’s do podcasts podcast where, I mean, what better way to learn more about the books and, you know, learn more about their ways of thinking and be able to promote them and share [00:59:00] that knowledge.

That’s why I just, I seriously just want to go buy this book for everybody and just hand it out today at the grocery store and be like, do this, the world 

Missy: was thinking it’s a, I’m putting it on my Christmas list. Like not for me, like as a gift I’m giving it.

Susanne: Yeah. Yes.

Missy: I’m giving it to maybe everybody. I know. Do you see like a mentally making a list right now?

Susanne: Yeah, we’re going to come up with a marketing plan for promoting your book for the holidays, and then we’re going to put together an entire speaking schedule for you for next

year, so, 

Megan: Cause I don’t get royalties. Like I don’t own the book. It’s like, so I 

Missy: Oh, 

Megan: everywhere, but,

Susanne: oh, okay. So we’ll pimp out your next book and we’ll make sure you get the money for that.

Megan: Yeah. It’s like, it’s good that the book gets out there and that lots of people are reading it and doing the work,

Missy: Yeah.

Megan: not motivated by that part of it because

Susanne: Well that makes it just extra honest though. The fact that you’re not getting anything out of it, but you still see the value of

people having it. 

Megan: that that’s, most important is 

Susanne: Yeah.

Missy: [01:00:00] yes. 

Megan: get it.

Susanne: Yes. Oh, well, I’m so excited and I really, I don’t know. I just want more places to hear from you. So that’s why we’re pushing so hard. So maybe we’re just calling you every once in a while and be like, Hey,

Missy: We’ll just have you back

and have a whole nother hour long.

Megan: a regular 

Susanne: Yes. You 

Missy: We could do like a regular self-love 

Susanne: Yes. You know what we need to do that? 

Megan: other than self-love like self love is just the book that I read it.

Missy: that’s

true. You have two decades plus of experience.

Susanne: So, oh, well, thank you so much for being on the show. We’ve learned so much and we’re learning so much for the process of going through the workbook. So excited.

Missy: Yeah, I cannot recommend enough that people go get the book and go through it. I kind of want to cancel the rest of my day and just sit with my book 

Susanne: I know I’m feeling, we need to do like a virtual book club within the cause we’ve got a private Facebook group, [01:01:00] but I think that could be, we kind of did the artist’s way that way once, , virtually through the group, you know, had people go buy their books and then we just kind of

talk through the exercises and shared about it.

Uh, so maybe that could be a good thing to do within the group to, to get us get us into the new year. I feel like we always wait until January 1st to reflect and think about these things, but like, let’s get people to the point where by the new year, like they’re just ready to jump into it. Don’t eat

Missy: Right, right. Like, let’s start 22, 20, 22. What year are we going into 20, 22, right? Yeah. I said it and I’m like, that can’t be right. 20, 22. Let’s just start at like hit the ground running. We’ll already be 

fired up. 

Susanne: oven.


Megan: for new years, uh, um, a vision board, we and my sister and I started that a couple of years ago. So every year we do a vision board and like a collage and we 

Missy: Yep. 

Megan: and posted, and that’s a good, a good way to 

Susanne: Oh, that would be fun. Ooh. If you would ever consider doing like, uh, [01:02:00] like something within the group, like guiding through what that looks like, that could be a really fun thing to do too. We’re

just going to really, we just want to get you everywhere. Yes,

Missy: many ideas like my head is spinning in a good way.

Susanne: I know I’m excited. Well, thank you so much again, I know how busy you are with, , everything that you’re doing. So we really appreciate you taking time out of your

busy schedule to be with us. 

Megan: to you both and I can’t wait to connect and listen to your podcasts in the future. 

Susanne: All right. Thank you

Missy: Thank you have a good afternoon and 

Susanne: Bye. 

Missy: your new fire pit.

Megan: thank you